To be honest, I understand their POV. But I was talking about this with my wife last night: is there anything a PM or political party can do that will prevent Shas or UTJ from joining the coalition? I don't mean being anti-religious; I'm talking about leadership. How bad or incompetent would the leader have to be for UTJ to forgo funds and stay out of his coalition? Would he have to be a criminal? Would even that be enough?
How bad or incompetent would the leader have to be for UTJ to forgo funds and stay out of his coalition? Would he have to be a criminal? Would even that be enough?
Why is incompetency a bad thing? My impression is that the charedi parties desire as weak a government as possible - one that is able to provide welfare to the poor (and support to yeshivos), as well as to keep the Egyptian army out of Yerushalayim, but that does not try to do anything else. This being the case, an absolute turnip who can be trusted to follow a couple of short instructions would be a perfect fit for the job.
I'm not actively criticizing, but just trying to understand the philosophy behind their politics. Please correct me if I'm mistaken.
Lets say they dump out Olmert. Who takes over? Peres? Barak? Netanyahu? They are all incompetent. They probably feel that one incompetent guy is as lousy as the rest of them. Is there any "higher-ups" in the government at all thats not messed up in one way or another? Might as well get something out of the government in the meantime
But my question still stands. Is there anything a PM can due short of enacting anti-religious laws that would make the Chareidi parties not join the coalition?
first of all, they have not (yet)accepted. They were simply approached with an offer and have negotiated for more and will eventually present it to the rabbonim for a decision.
Second of all, "ain chadash tachat hashemesh" - this is nothing new. They have joined horrible governments for money. Yes, this seems to make them into prostitutes, willing to sell everything for some cash for yeshivas, but pon the other hand, this is what their constituencies are concerned about. Not national issues. So why should they not talk about such a deal? Because you and I don't like it? did you vote for them? did I? Do they have to do what we want or what their constituents want?
to the charedi parties the government is only a vehicle for giving them money and occasionally passing laws they want
they don't care about the country or the consequences to anyone but themselves because they see themselves as the only thing in the country that matters anyway
8 comments:
Why, at this stage, is it hard to believe? They're l'shitasam.
To be honest, I understand their POV. But I was talking about this with my wife last night: is there anything a PM or political party can do that will prevent Shas or UTJ from joining the coalition? I don't mean being anti-religious; I'm talking about leadership. How bad or incompetent would the leader have to be for UTJ to forgo funds and stay out of his coalition? Would he have to be a criminal? Would even that be enough?
How bad or incompetent would the leader have to be for UTJ to forgo funds and stay out of his coalition? Would he have to be a criminal? Would even that be enough?
Why is incompetency a bad thing? My impression is that the charedi parties desire as weak a government as possible - one that is able to provide welfare to the poor (and support to yeshivos), as well as to keep the Egyptian army out of Yerushalayim, but that does not try to do anything else. This being the case, an absolute turnip who can be trusted to follow a couple of short instructions would be a perfect fit for the job.
I'm not actively criticizing, but just trying to understand the philosophy behind their politics. Please correct me if I'm mistaken.
Lets say they dump out Olmert. Who takes over? Peres? Barak? Netanyahu? They are all incompetent. They probably feel that one incompetent guy is as lousy as the rest of them. Is there any "higher-ups" in the government at all thats not messed up in one way or another?
Might as well get something out of the government in the meantime
Why is incompetency a bad thing?
Think Summer of 2006 for that answer.
But my question still stands. Is there anything a PM can due short of enacting anti-religious laws that would make the Chareidi parties not join the coalition?
A weak government will very quickly run out of money for everything.
These kinds of actions are what fuel the bad perceptions of the Charedi world in the secular world.
first of all, they have not (yet)accepted. They were simply approached with an offer and have negotiated for more and will eventually present it to the rabbonim for a decision.
Second of all, "ain chadash tachat hashemesh" - this is nothing new. They have joined horrible governments for money. Yes, this seems to make them into prostitutes, willing to sell everything for some cash for yeshivas, but pon the other hand, this is what their constituencies are concerned about. Not national issues. So why should they not talk about such a deal? Because you and I don't like it? did you vote for them? did I? Do they have to do what we want or what their constituents want?
to the charedi parties the government is only a vehicle for giving them money and occasionally passing laws they want
they don't care about the country or the consequences to anyone but themselves because they see themselves as the only thing in the country that matters anyway
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